1st Appointment Talking Points Flashcards Preview

1st Appt and Peg System > 1st Appointment Talking Points > Flashcards

Flashcards in 1st Appointment Talking Points Deck (51):

1) Tie, Start Have a 15-25 minute first appointment on the phone. 

2) Noah: Mutual Agreement

See if ... serious. (incentive to do something)

See if ... qualified.

Then meet them face to face. It’s beautiful because it saves time, money and allows you to be much more efficient with your work day

1) "tie": Start:

Hi ___, This is Rusty Barton with ___________ (Your Company).  Is this still a good time for a 15 to 20 minute complimentary visit?


ok, great...and...just so you know...If at any point you feel this isn’t what you’re looking for, will you please let me know, and we can just cut it off, does that work for you?


3) Ham: Framing - The mindset of how he approaches every call (to eliminate emotional baggage) - His demeanor and the questions he asks to control the conversation. ...tax advantaged or tax priviledged strategy


 (were you hoping for?)


…wealth beyond Wall Street referred you to me, I’m really just here to help …based on the ad, you called about protecting your money from losses, maybe (saving) money on taxes, or growing your money potential double digits and identify possible retirement income gaps…..if you can… can you tell me specifically why you called originally and what’re you trying to accomplish with your money?


So…I let them kind of tell me what’s going on, what they’re looking for.  And I might have to ask some qualifying questions, but then I say…

3. "ham" FRAMING:

a. Ok, first of all, just so you know, I'm really just here to help.  I'm a licensed independent insurance agent, and I am curious, when you heard one of our ads, either on the TV or the radio, and it touched on... 

i. they may’ve touched on the Benefit Protection (BP) to manage risk (MR) for your future living needs (FLN) or your beneficiary’s financial needs or,  

ii.  they may have touched on protecting your money from losses, maybe saving money on taxes, or

iii. IDENTIFYing possible retirement income gaps (RIG) (Oh, and a Tax Advantaged Strategy (TAS) to supplement your retirement needs (RN).

b. So, when you initially responded to one of our ads, what exactly were you looking for?  Can you tell me specifically why you called and what you're trying to accomplish with your money? Anything in particular?

ok, good..we can definitely cover that and just so we don’t duplicate anything from here …tell me…a little bit about your current situation…


Brian basement guy 4 with #22 or 1?

the Golden RDS

"I'm always thinking:

How much value can I bring…how can I serve them…how can I be indispensible to them… education…understanding... some cases not a good fit…"


Everything does have its advantages and disadvantages

As I’ve worked with my clients, I’ve noticed that these strategies can be extremely valuable and beneficial to people…when it’s a good fit... depending on their circumstances and depending on what they’re trying to accomplish…other times it’s not…and that’s ok.


I establish that up front magic in this line:

And it's no different with this. So, I don’t want you to expect that what I show you today is gonna be a perfect product. (because such a thing doesn’t exist for all situations and conditions)

...what I do or what I have or what we're gonna discuss today...isn't a perfect fit for everyone... ..............won't be a perfect fit for everyone

(client name), I’ve worked with enough people to know that what I do isn’t a perfect fit for everyone. If it's a good fit for you, great. If not, that’s ok too.

And (client ), you’ve been round the block enough times to know that there are advantages and disadvantages to about any financial solution or product you look at out there.  And it’s no different with this. 

So, I don’t want you to expect that what I show you today is gonna be a perfect product...because there are some disadvantages.  And in some cases the advantages are going to greatly outweigh the disadvantages and hopefully we can do business. But if that’s not the case here, I’m ok with that.



4) hair: Discovery


“What’s your plan to _______ that ______?” A killer question you can swipe and deploy The VERY BEST part of the entire call, is when he says “There is no such thing as unbiased advice.”


a: nada (could be that) it’s not that big of a deal to you…are you just not worried about taxes? I know you mentioned that you’re interested in the growth of this strategy…are taxes not a big worry for you? (could be...haven't given it thought) ok, good we’ll get into that later.. and (great pivot to keep on track)

ok…and..is that a concern at all? if potentially this big a .. spike in the market actually correcting itself at some point?

Obviously we’re talking today.. and (presumably) that’s because you’re out there looking for something different… and so, how long has that been? 

4. "hair" Discovery

a. Just so we don’t duplicate anything from here, tell me about your current situation…   

b. well…obviously we can’t control the direction of taxes in the future, but what steps have you taken to manage taxes if they go up? (Tax Steps MT)

c. ...and obviously We can’t forecast the stock market, but there’s always a possibility of another downturn that could create more losses…what’ve you done in your current plan TO HELP so that you’re prepared against market volatility?  

d. ok, and so How long have you been looking for an alternative solution?

ok good… well it does seem like that, based on what I’ve heard so far, that there’re some areas in your financial strategy where I may be able to help… I can provide you some information to get you thinking about diversifying your portfolio…how does that sound?

ok, so, as we go into this … for the next few minutes… I’ll explain some of the strategies that we use and you can see if any of these’d be a good fit.


5) "hail o hill": ,

6) shoe: (Alt2):


Well, there are a lot of strategies I could talk about.  NOT ALL of them are going to apply to you.  So, if you don't mind, let me just ask you a few pointed questions to understand where you're coming from...that way I can kind of calibrate my conversation to more closely match what I hear you saying...ok?

5. "hail o hill"

(ALT 2): well sounds like you’ve got things pretty well under control.

a. What parts, if any, would want to change?

6. BUDGET/QUALIFY: - So..as you look out over, say, your next 10 to 15 years,

- Are you looking to get... MORE GROWTH?   

- Would a DEATH BENEFIT protection be a big deal? -

- Or are you looking MORE for a STABLE INCOME (base)?

... and are you looking to build some retirement income?  




(after budget qualification step) I always, always ask them what’s more important to them,  I say,

(after budget qualification step) I always, always ask them what’s more important to them,  I say,

ok, Mrs. Smith, I could take this conversation one of two ways based on what you just told me, let me  (run by) you what those 2 ways are, you tell me sounds more interesting. 

1: Are you looking to add additional cash flow to your retirement, something that’s dependable, something that you know is always going to come in later on in life, or immediately. 

2: Or do you feel like cash flow is already taken care of, you already have a pension set up, that’s not really of concern, you’re more interested in growing and protecting, just a lump sum of money, that you can access anytime and go golfing and travel whenever you want…what sounds more interesting to you?


7) k, j, ch as in loch key: Book

7) "key": Book

Have you had a chance to read our book yet? Wealth Beyond Wall Street


8) f, v hoof: Indexed Universal LIfe Insurance


IKEA success partly built on element of mystery or what's around the corner and building something together

...protection (using a solid safety mechanism) solid...floor

mechanism: zero trap w Indexed Universal Life Insurance Policy or Equity Indexed Universal Life Insurance Policy ...we don't get to label the products...

Universal: implies great flexibility and lattitude

Equity = stock (usually) Indexed = grouping of individual stocks (usually)

Life = trick question...both living lifetime and after life Insurance = protection

(now I know that's a mouthful...in the industry the acronym is IUL and I'll explain what the significance of each part...)

8) "hoof" IUL (Fancy term for very versatile solution)

So, one of the strategies that I'd recommend based on your priorities ...is one with a little bit of protection, but also upside growth…

a. This is a specially designed Indexed Life Insurance policy that can potentially provide tax advantaged cash flow, as well as provide a death benefit to protect your family.  And there are other benefits that could be tax preferred too.

b. This life insurance policy, insofar as it’s structured and funded correctly, can provide both a death benefit protection, and access to a tax preferred cash value and living benefits.

c. One of the benefits to this type of life insurance is how the cash value can grow over time.

It’s called IUL because it builds cash value that earns interest, based on underlying market indices like the S’n’P 500. It’s important to keep in mind that a person can’t actually invest directly in an index.

d. At the end of the segment term, your policy is credited based on the performance of the underlying index...and the crediting method that's used. There are some strategies that are uncapped and as such have no limit on your index crediting potential. We can talk more about that in another appointment.


9)a. p, b "bee": A couple of things to be aware of...

different cap rates

floor of zero

...The caps can change. Meaning they aren’t guaranteed to stay fixed. It’s important you work with a company that has several years’ experience and a history of not dramatically changing caps over time. 

9) "bee"

a. The first thing to be aware of is that, there are different caps. If, for example, there's a cap of around 12 – 13 percent and if the market goes up 15% your indexed account would receive a credit of 12-13 percent because it hit that cap or ceiling.

b. The second thing to be aware of is you have a SOLID FLOOR OF ZERO, so you’ll never take a loss because of a market downturn. You’ll have certain costs such as insurance and fees each year, which is why it’s so important to optimize these policies for maximum cash value growth.

In those years where you get a 0 credit, there’d still be insurance costs and fees; however, your policy will not go negative because of a downturn. My clients find this exception appealing. I’ll show you how we do that next time we talk. Any thoughts?


9b. "bee" A couple of things to be aware of... (objections) see 9b1 for alternate version from video...more in depth


How is it invested?  the answer lies in the inverse of that...How isn't it invested...no stock market exposure

9b. "bee" OBJECTIONS:

i. Example (if necessary). For example, if the market loses 20 percent, you won’t lose 20 percent. You’ll have policy fees and expenses and you won’t gain anything.

ii. (How is it invested?) The money isn’t invested in the market. Your premium payments are used to pay the cost of insurance and other costs. Anything above those costs is allocated to an indexed account that receives interest credits based on performance of the underlying index.

Again, a person can’t invest in an index. You can allocate premiums to available fixed accounts as well. The fixed accounts credit interest at a fixed rate, say 2% or 4% or whatever.

iii. (Do you manage the money?) Oh, no, we’re just agents. The policy’s administered by an insurance company.


10) "toes": Policy Performance and 11) "dot": Takeaway


On our next appointment, I’ll take you through the numbers…..which’ll be really interesting because you’ll be able to see the historical performance…and you’ll be able to actually see it in black and white on an illustration and a blueprint….and see the past 30 years of performance of the s&p 500 and see how these policies have performed.

11. "dot" TAKEAWAY:

so, my question to you at this point is...thinking about an alternative solution, how do you feel about the idea of using an IUL strategy, do you think it could help you in diversifying your portfolio?

(let them answer)


12. "town" Tax PREferred (I prefer tax-priviledged)

12 town (think Duvall...a tax-priviledged town)

congress has given it a priviledged status which is one of the great advantages...

(tax free *3) + 2 growth, access, death...no age 70 1/2 rmd n no penalty pre 59 1/2 other than early years


 (or more accurately the mistreatment it avoids)…

12. "town" TAX-PREFERRED:

ok, the last piece you need to be aware of is the tax preferred piece of the puzzle... because one of the biggest benefits of using this strategy is the tax treatment it gets

Congress has given it a tax-priviledged status and for that reason a lot of professional CPA’s have called it the best benefit left in the tax code (get actual quote from ??).

So, You can access cash value in a tax preferred manner.  As you know, you can count on one hand the tax-advantaged options available.

Another example of a tax-advantaged option is the death benefit on a life insurance policy. The problem with that … as you get older, life insurance may be too expensive.

[(tax free *3) + 2 growth, access, death...no age 70 1/2 rmd n no penalty pre 59 1/2 other than early years]


13. "dime" We Restructure a, b, c, d

(conditioned to hear)

(friction down)

 (max efficiency)

13. "dime" WE STRUCTURE:

And the way that it’s funded is a big part of what makes it different from what most clients may be used to... …we use a life insurance contact and we fund it well over and above the cost of the insurance.

a. When you buy Life insurance, usually you're trying to get the highest death benefit per dollar spent.

b. In our case, we're going to do the reverse.

c. We also help minimize the cost by reducing the death benefit so the bulk of your money goes towards cash accumulation.

d. Then when it comes time to access the money you take a loan from the policy.


13. "dime" We Restructure continued

e, f, g 

(this part was added by Ethan in video):

Let me just recap this in a more simple way. basically you’re overfunding a policy so there’s a lot of money in your cash value account … and when you want to use it…you’re borrowing it from an insurance co…when you borrow the money it’s not taxeds.

…you get a car loan, you don’t pay tax…it’s not income to you… right?

..it’s just a loan. (the insurance policy is granted protections from paying taxes on gains and …

(goes in a way you could say the policy provides “cover” from the tax man)

so, you’re taking the money from the insurance company and when you die, your db pays the loan… so you don’t have to pay it back out of your own pocket. the db is there to pay it for you.

13b. "dime" We Restructure continued

e. The reason that's important is because there's no tax on borrowed money as long as you keep the policy in force, and so long as the policy is not a Modified Endowment Contract. A modified endowment contract is a life insurance policy that’s been funded with more money than allowed by federal law. The funding limitations are put in place by the IRS.

f. That allows you to access your cash accumulation value without paying any taxes on it under current tax laws.

g. Any question on how this works?


14. "tire" What's the Catch? 

14. "tire" WHAT’S THE CATCH:

So, what's the catch? The catch to that is that eventually you do have to pay the loans back, and you do get charged an interest rate. ...but the beauty of this is that your money can continue to grow in the cash value (as though it never went missing) even though you’ve borrowed against it.

a. And so you can ultimately pay those loans off with the db. ...And what’s left passes on to your beneficiaries tax free. 

b. The policy loan plus interest may grow to equal the policy cash value while you’re alive. If that happens, you would either:

i. Have to pay back the loan interest or)

ii. Or, You could even exercise the policy rider that freezes the policy c. Make sense?


15. "doll" Summary i, ii, iii  

Your money is in a safe place

Access to cash

No penalties to access 

15. "doll" Summary:

So, Let’s summarize how the policy works:

i. The money’s protected from stock market losses, because it’s not in the market (or even exposed to the market).

ii. You have access to the cash value for emergencies or other opportunities in the form of a policy loan.

iii. Once you’re past the surrender period, there’re no penalties or age restrictions on having access to the money in the form of a policy loan, as long as the policy is not a modified endowment contract.


15. "doll" Summary iv, v and a: new q's? anything else?  

Growth...tax free

15 "doll" Summary continued

iv. The money grows tax-deferred.

v.  You have access to the cash value for expenses, emergencies, or other opportunities as a policy loan…whatever suites you…business investments, investment app’s, retirement income stream…whatever you want… 

The cash value, in many cases, can be accessed tax-preferred using a policy loan to help supplement (or contribute to) your retirement enjoyment and needs.

a. Does this raise any new questions for you? or "Questions?"



How does this compare to how you've viewed life insurance in the past?


(I had over a million in 401k…and many friends…one with $500..got creamed…still not back to even…)…

Kitchen (with some of my words):

Gotta be a better way to do this..because of the market cycles..it goes up and it goes down ...

and participated in some long bull markets...

up and up and then wham...and you think it’s over and jump in again and find out the market has it’s own mind as to when it’s finished venting…

kind of feels like after every market crash you’re back to you started…  

I wanted a way to potentially get healthy growth on my money but not lose it.

...and that’s how I discovered this strategy and that’s how I decided to share it with others. it became my career. because I’m so passionate about helping people avoid those kind of catostrophic losses that happened to me. 

16. "tissue" How does this compare...NOTICE OF DIFFERENCE:

How does this compare to how you’ve viewed life insurance in the past?

added in video??? so when you consider how to make sure you have sufficient income in retirement, is this something you can add to your existing portfolio along with your 401k’s and social security…? that’s something we’ll talk about next time..to actually do some analysis of where your retirement cash flow will be… I call it a retirement gap analysis…

questions? what’re your thoughts?


17. "duck" NEXT STEP


(see how to merge: there’re a couple more issues that I think would be interesting for you to see…like the retirement gap analysis where we actually plug in the amount of money you have in your 401k’s ira’s est. ss… and then look at all that together and say “ok, how much income is that going to produce for you”, and how adding the IUL to the puzzle will help supplement that. is that something you’d like to see when we get together next time? )

17. "duck" NEXT STEP:

Typically, the next step is to create an illustration and a blueprint for you specifically. It’ll show you how the policy works based on your age, sex, underwriting class, premium payment, death benefit, and an assumed hypothetical indexed account performance.

So next time we talk we'll discuss in more detail how it works.  I’ll show you the numbers in black and white. And you’ll be able to see, ok if I put x $$’s in, what can I expect in terms of what I get in dollars out.

Is that something you’d like to see?


18. "dove" CALIBRATE: 


questions? anything else? last time we discussed... and you... anything changed?

18. "dove" CALIBRATE:

So, how we doing? Can we pause to take your measure? On the ‘ol familiar scale of 1 to 10, what’s your interest level? (in learning more about incorporating life insurance into your strategy?)

Questions? Thoughts?

Anything elsle?


19. "tub" Okay, the next time we meet 

19. "tub"

Okay, the next time we meet, can you be in front of a computer? ...so we can step through your illustration? And I'll give you PDF report you can keep.

We need 30 t0 45 minutes. I have ____ day _____ and ______ day available (within next 2-4 days if possible)

a. What works best for you?

b. Okay, and what time?

c. Great, now you’ll be in front of your computer, right?


20. "nose" MINI FACT FIND a,b,c  

sniff it out...

Company that sold "sniffers"... Total Network Visibility...

Total Financial Visibility...


20. "nose" MINI FACT FIND.

May I ask a couple more questions to get that going? 

a. so...What is your current age?

b. Hypothetically, about how much do you think you could put into something like this?  

c. Ok great, let me write that down, that sounds good...and at What age do you think you'd plan on taking money out for retirement cash flow?



20. "nose" MINI FACT FIND d, e, f 

20. "nose" Mini Fact Finder continued

d. (Optional) How much in retirement income would you guess you’ll need to maintain your standard of living?

e. (Optional) You mentioned previously, you had roughly ________ in assets. That about right?

f. (Optional) Can you break that down for me in finer detail? That is.. Do you have an IRA or 401(k)? What’s a quick $$ estimate for that account?


20. "nose: continued MINI FACT FIND g, h 

20. "nose" Mini Fact Finder continued

g. (Optional) Do you have any pensions?

h. (Optional) Any real estate properties? What cash flow do you receive from them on a yearly basis?

Anything else?


21. "net" PREMIUMS: 


Is there another chunk of money somewhere in a bank account or elsewhere that’s not earning much interest that you would want to plug in here?


Additional benefits you can describe to the client for putting more money in year one: 

•Increases the Life Insurance amount thereby increasing the MEC limit so the prospect can contribute more down the road. Many people look for this benefit.

•The client gets more money in earlier to compound and grow the policy faster.

•NOTE: If it’s a large lump sum (greater than 15k) make sure you pay attention to the MEC limit because you will probably need to dump it in over 3-5 years.

21. "net" PREMIUMS:

I'm going to create an illustration based on those numbers.

However it can be really help your long term performance to jump start the policy and get the time value of money working for you. 

Do you have any extra money, just sitting there maybe on the sidelines, that we could add as a lump sum in addition to your premium?



25. "nail" CALENDER:  

25. "nail' CALENDER:

Super, now you’ve got the appointment on your calendar? Would you mind reading that back to me...so I know I have it right? I’ve been known to transpose or fat-finger it more than once.

if need email... ok, perfect, now a….im showing xyzzy as your current email…is that right?

… I’ll send you a confirmation email…as kind of a reminder along with my contact info and if something comes up and you can’t make the appt…then just shoot me back so we can reschedule… that work?


22. "nun" Take away  

22. "nun" TAKE AWAY:

This strategy isn’t for everyone. I just want to make sure you know that:

a. Is using life insurance to help reduce taxes out of the question for you?

b. (Optional) Is doing business over the phone and computer going to be a problem for you?

If we need to meet, we can arrange that in the future. Does that work?


23. "name" Decision step: (23 name)


or: ok, good, (sounds like a line..stiff) so, who else, in addition to yourself, gets involved in decisions concerning your retirement?

are you planning on traveling the world by yourself, take your spouse with you..how is that gonna work for you?

(sounded clumsy to me…sharpen it up and soften it up) kids…. Anyone else?

23. "name" Decision step:

Well, In addition to yourself, who else’d be involved in your retirement? Spouse? Financial Advisor?

Anyone else?

a. Would they benefit by being on the next call?


24. "New yeaR" POST-SELL:  

24. "New yeaR" POST-SELL:

Now, let me take the pressure off. Mr. Brown,

I’m going to block out our time on my calendar to be able to share this information with you. I’m planning on this meeting just as if you were going to walk into my office. It’s on my calendar in stone. (make funny... On my calendar in stone...)

a. But, if this really isn’t something you’re interested in, now is a great time to bail out with no hard feelings.

b. (Optional) Time has become my most precious commodity. I’d imagine it’s the same for you? So I’ll be very respectful of your time.

My calendar fills quickly and I can only afford to fill it with people who’re sincerely interested and will be there.

c. Is there anything that’s going to stand in the way of you picking up the phone when I call?


IUL or Annuity?  Both Safety

IUL or Annuity?  Both Safety


IUL = Cash Flow and Tax Protection (growth, access, heirs) and DB


Annuity Strategies:

1: Accumulation Annuity = grow (with the market) and protect a lump sum of money

2: Guaranteed Income Annuity

3: Continuation Annuity

Ex: SEP IRA "Why would you ever keep your money in the market, especially with what happened last week, when you can get VIRTUALLY virtually the SAME growth as in the markets when it does go up WITHOUT ANY RISK?”  All of them say, ok, I never thought of it that way.


26 "notch" Post Call Notes

(Notch o Niche)

26 "notch" *POST CALL NOTES:

(Review of Articles) IN THE MAIL (Not email)

Send your notes from the call, The 16 skeptical questions article and any other articles that pertain to the pains and problems they have. (See article library online.)


The Peg System

0 = s, x, z

1 = t,d

2 = n

3 = m

4 = r

5 = l

6 = sh, ch, j, soft g

7 = c, k, hard g, q

8 = f, v

9 = p, b

This would make the number 33 "MM" which could be made into the word "mom" to better aid in memorization or 92 is "PN" and could become "pen."[4] The PAO System Edit


0: zoo 1 tie 2 Noah 3 ham

4 hair 5 hail, hell o hill 6 shoe

7 Key 8 hoof 9 bee

10 toes 11 dot 12 town (think Duvall)

13 dime 14 tire 15 doll

16 tissue 17 duck 18 dove  

19 tub 20 nose 21 net

22 nun 23 name (Nemo) 24 New yeaR (NRA)

25 nail 26 notch (niche) 27 Neck

28 knife 29 knob 30 mouse

31 mat 32 moon 33 mom


9b1  I've heard neg things re LIfe Insurance....

(um… so this is life insurance… a I’ve heard bad things about life insurance on the radio and you know, people say that life insurance is a bad investment… and ..im curious abut that…) 

You are not alone. Everybody hates life insurance, don’t they? well..it’s one f those necessary evils, right?

and… if something happens to me I want to be sure someone’s taking care my family, but I’ve never thought of it as a way to save for retirement because…

thought of it as a way to provide for your family if you die.. yea.. and there’s no question about it…for that kind of thing, Term life insurance, that’s basically what it’s used for… simply to give some db protection to your family. 

We’re talking about a different type and, this may be some of the things you’ve heard about…as for negatives..where people’ve heard...

People complain about permanent policies being too expensive and they’re totally right.

In the past a lot of these policies have been geared toward the ultra affluent who didn’t really care about the expenses in the policy…

or people who weren't ultra affluent were buying policies and they were very expensive and most of their money basically went to the agent who sold them a big commission policy, and so the agent made a big commission and the policy grew very very slowly, if at all.

In many cases people had very little cash value and so, you can see why people would be upset with that. 

so, why’re we using this strategy then?  Exactly...why would we use a strategy like that? We wouldn’t.

What we are talking about is a new development over (just) the last 10… 15 years that , you know how there’s never more than a year that goes by without a new iPhone, right? the next iPhone, the next innovation (and for many of the same reasons…technology allows or enables it

....and the same kind of thing have happened with these types of life insurance policies, and so over the past 10 15 years there have been a lot of innovations that’ve helped them to become much more efficient at helping the average person grow their wealth, grow their cash value and build a retirement cash flow that you typically wouldn’t have received in one of those old policies.

…that you likely heard of. You go online, you’ll see people complaining about the expenses and the fees and all that… (and they’re right) …it’s basically because so many policies are structured improperly…

they’re structured for a benefit for the agent…not for the client.. and we do just the opposite.

When I found this strategy, I found it for myself first…so, I built this policy to maximize my own wealth…and that’s the way we do it for our clients as well… because we’re not here to sell Life Insurance, that’s not what we do by itself (good word here? self-?? or?)…

We sell life insurance because it has these benefits (attached)…does that make sense?

yea, and it sounds like you’re a little apprehensive…is it to the point where you’re ready to shut it off and go on your way? Or are you still interested in seeing how this 

…like I said, at any point, if you know this isn’t for you and you absolutely hate life insurance… regardless of what it can do for you…then let me know… but there is a lot that most people don’t know about (aware of) and, frankly, you probably aren’t aware that some of the wealthiest people…bus. exec’s, owners, celebrities, banks…politicians and even head football coaches…michigan wolverines… all use in their retirement planning…

so, it’s something that you might want to spend some more time at least “discovering” as you process

so…let’s continue here for a second and i’ll just explain how it works to give you a feel for whether or not…at that point you can tell me whether or not you’re interested..that be ok? 

so obviously.. because it’s a life insurance policy you’re gonna have certain costs like insurance and fees each year, which is why it’s important to optimize these policies…to maximize your cash value and minimize your costs and fees,

however, you’re policy is never going to go negative because of a downturn… ...so if the market loses 20%…you won’t lose 20%…

you’ll have some of these fees, and you’re not going to gain anything in your policy in that year… but you will know that you’re not going to lose 20% in the market like you would (if exposed) any any other stock investment…. the reason for that is because of the way these policies are built…and it’s built using options…

i’ll give you a quick overview of how this works… people hear this and (naturally) say “oh that sounds too good to be true”… 

(well now, and the insurance companies are going to want a profit…got to work for both sides of table)..

The insurance company buys options and they say “if the market goes up 14%, I’m going to exercise the option and credit your account that amount. But if the market doesn’t go up and it goes down… then we’re just going to let that option expire and we don’t lose anything…

and, like I said, a certain amount goes to feesthose fees are what they use to buy the options…that make sense?

ok..so, here’s how it works… your money goes in (for a month or a year or more)…at the end of the segment term the insurance company puts money into your account based on the performance of the index…and the crediting method used for the index account. so, there’s gonna be some verbiage with some new terms and it might sound a little complicated on the first go..

I’ll try to make it as simple as possible (at least for me)…(don’t worry…no test and we’ll explain fully)…

when an index, say the snp 500 grows, your money can grow along with it… your money is linked to the growth of that index, and there are strategies that are capped at at say 12 or 14 or 15% growth…and there are some strategies that have no limit on your index crediting POTENTIAL…so if that particular index shoots up say 35% in a given year, guess what? you’re getting 35%,

but on the flip side, when the market goes down you never lose money in your crediting account because of the market loss. Does that make sense? so you’re never gonna lose money because of a market loss…in the index strategy.

But you can gain up t the cap or if you choose an uncapped strategy you can earn an unlimited theoretically…depending on what that index does….

ok and also it goes toward the DB as well. Which’ll be there if something happens. But, within the policy, if the market goes up 15% or 20% if it’s an uncapped strategy …they’ll exercise the option and you’ll have the ability then to realize that gain within the cash value of your policy (I like to call it your ever growing reservoir of $$).

 questions? followed by a pause)?  


Kitchen Musings ....had opened a review into the ... “to determine the appropriate next steps.” assistant calls them back and resets appts….same logic could be useful in a positive manner for most anything: review your goals and circumstances to determine... paperwork, follow-up Homework between appts…we’re gonna send you an email…watch video… you’re the doctor and assistant is the nurse …how do they think? very important to tap into their train of thought… so they know you share same belief system… we don’t trust washington and wall street when it comes to our money and the security of our retirement… do you? next building trust and equalizing the playing field… of 13% growth, or double digit growth, why didn’t you jump on board with that?

what is it you’re trying to accomplish?

why are we talking and can I help you get there pre-emptive strike…take objection off table

…nothing to be sold today so you don’t need to worry… next meeting or later

…take it off by addressing fees, other advisors…

I gave him too much logic… easy to get into logical sell…it doesn’t work that way… don’t present to the numbers… talk to heart and emotion…

I didn’t even scratch surface of pain funnel…. other not making him dream…what are hopes and dreams?

… no mutual mystification one of Sandler rules… no clearly defined outcome (what in world doing here)...why not say...When we start a process...."what in the world are we doing here" if they're not willing to set another appt it’s over..

never cut your prospect off unless doing negative reverse selling to save a deal going south…

I didn’t give him any homework… watch video…read chapter 6 to 8…if they invest time…much higher odds problem…agitate…solve throughout interaction…no awkward sales person interaction….their problem, not yours.. …honest interaction… decision step…who else is involved in decision like this? can’t afford them taking your stuff and giving to local agent…. critical points of virtual selling… - relieving the pressure cooker …let steam dissipate… “not” getting ready to be sold


Brian basement guy 1

Brian Casto on a LInkedin Discussion: A good response to "no" is: "that's fine, not a problem, okay. So, let me just...do you mind if I ask...when you say "no," does that mean never ever or just not now?" This opens up a whole new conversation. A client who really wants a solution (or buy a product) will be driving in that direction. Too often we sales people think it is about selling (our sales skill, our product, etc.), but it ‘s really about buying (customer addressing a need, fixing a problem, etc.). ...Annuities in their crosshairs...could be... because that’s money they don’t and can’t manage with trillions...easy to target...since futile to directly focus on direct competitors ...largely bluster...and Ken Fisher only takes on over $500K and up... ...the questions covered the waterfront...


Brian basement guy 2

Brian… tips Brian Lund…working 16 months or so with Elite…great ride… Wake up…go to the gym…or read and sharpen my saw… Then do my appts…look at my calendar Sunday night…Monday to Friday I have appts…all from my laptop in the basement… Take week off…have Peter hold off a week…and come back to full schedule when I get back to bring value and if doesn’t fit into your situation…it’s ok… that coupled with being to be home every day…


Brian basement guy 3

Memorize If when Financial advisors pretend or position a financial product to be perfect for everyone …and if it’s not a fit it created 2 potential problems: 1: The advisor could easily degenerate into a “Pest”…trying to Defend an untenable position, and it’s always a mistake to do anything other than what’s in the clients best interest. 2: The client, sensing it’s not a fit…to avoid conflict or an uncomfortable Situation might… “Go dark” or say something like “let me think about it” & I’ll call… Or just make up an excuse to avoid further discussion… Neither of us want that, so can we agree to call it a day if it’s not •A good fit and, on the other hand... Brian’s …tracking cases on white board...rolling pending pushing through underwriting $121K commission last four weeks in process… last week 3 apps, 2 the week before… I try to get at least 1/wk.. brian was one of pioneers to help develop the process…


Brian the basement guy 5 ...first call and first call follow John, my understanding is that you heard one of my features on the radio, I think it was either Fox News or Bloomberg or one of the talk stations there locally, and you called in and requested a copy of our best selling book, safe money millionaires, is that (why we’re talking) or “the case”? Yup, couple days ago… (we have some credibility) and I go on to build the trust…they’re working with experts, with people who know what they’re doing…and we do know what we’re doing. We bring value to people every day. What we saw in 2001 and 2008…so many got taken advantage and no different in 2008 ..so many advisors didn’t care about anything but themselves. ... and people got tired of that… rightfully we should have to establish trust… a lot of the people we talk to went through that…

Everything is very strategic. Nothing we do or say is just an accident. Hey you heard me on the radio. …putting back into their head… and 3rd..you spoke to one of my assistants.. oh, you’ve got assistants… refined and strategic… How to develop a consistent flow of info to these folk to support the sales process…send stuff via direct mail… People between 50 and 70 years old… something in mail…I have something in my hands someone took time to send…I should value this…that’s important After first conversation…I drop more info into the mail…. Packages all go out in priority envelope $5.60 to send…gets opened… and is cheap… 2 days delivered and excited to get it… Material showing that’s nice and the face of our business…attach a cover letter explaining stuff with every mailing with my picture… Walt Disney…Ray Crock…JC Penney……establishes a lot of trust and also “maybe I should do this too…Walt Disney?


Brian the basement guy 6 mailings & nurturing

Serious Trust …from credible mailings…. Informational report …reinforces what we discussed… they begin to be comfortable with who they’re working with (Lisa does this) Not fly by night… gives them warm fuzzies… and furthers the sale….we’re getting results… Sharing great content…follow-up in mail… videos and emails don’t sit around the house…. In front of them in ever present way… a month later tey’ll call “I’m ready to go” … Plant the seeds… can’t rush the cases…nurture and take care of until produces fruit…


Brian the basement guy Underwriting take

Process for when in underwriting… sale not made… they need to stay hot during underwriting process. How much value can I provide…how be indispensable… make sure they’re set with tax free retirement or guaranteed income for life.. 4th and 5th appts all about education… these plans designed to take care of specific needs. We establish the need… here’s what we do to take care of.. here’s how you’re never going to have to worry about this ever again… another appt a week later… appt while in underwriting…go into a lot more detail about taxes.. qualified plan vs if in 20% tax bracket…deferred taxes…. When in retirement…paying $45K in taxes to get that money out… to show them how thes things work…that’s valuable to them… Stop selling using the illustration!!!


Brian basement guy video but Ethan set appt up front contract

Set next appt…upfront contact… On this next appt I’m going to show you the numbers so you can see how beneficial this might be for you… I “We’ve got this scheduled as if you were walking right into my office. (assuming virtual)… so if something comes up and you can’t make it, I need you to give me a call and talk to my assistant or ..to reschedule. Does that work for you? Is there any reason you could see yourself missing this appt? No. Ok… so then you take it away and make sure they’re really set for this. (I’m talking with Dr/Patient authority and they’ll fall in line and say “ok, this guy knows what he’s doing”. ) Esp. virtually…need to work from position of power and authority… otherwise…they can easily blow you off…


Brian basement guy video but Ethan comments little things matter and developing trust comments

Little things matter. Bruce Barton… there is no such thing as a little thing. Add up to make sale or lose sale…and you din’t even know… …go into appts without any expectations.. be neutral or will possibly be thinking wrong things… clear head… …use emotion as a professional… Key: developing trust… Invisible Saboteur…people more distrustful than ever before… people got burned bad in last two crashes… folk making decisions out of fear…they distrust everybody… some distrust business… even Pastor’s… lots of skepticism… expect it! “gotta be something in it for him…”…kills sales and you didn’t even see it… Won’t have deals killed because people don’t trust you… verbal sign when people let down their defenses…


Brian basement guy but Ethan?? big 4 and other

Next recommendation…. Now you’re the doctor… you need to look at a strategy…that you need to look at strategy… 1: Protect your money from market from crashes (can’t say safety any more) 2: grow potentially double digits.. up during good years 3: Protect it from increasing taxes 4: and have a retirement cash flow at end of day you can use to supplement what you’re doing.. So what I need to do is prepare a blueprint so you can see in black and white what the actual numbers personalized for your situation would look like when you implement this strategy. So you can see just how powerful this is in your life? Is that something you’d like me to do? Is that something you’d be interested in seeing? To see how beneficial this might be for you?


Brain basement guy but Ethan or Brett? when you meet with your advisor....

Another: so when your advisor meets with you every year to go over these things, how does that meeting happen? He doesn’t… Next market loss sample question…questions to get them to verbalize their frustration… Tell me, were you like the majority of people who lost 30 to 40% during the last market crash? In round numbers, about how much did you lose? You know, I only ask this because money’s different to everybody, is that a lot of money to you? (helping them see…yea that was a big loss) So, are you prepared to lose 30 or 40% when the market crashes the next time? (contrast…I didn’t like this, I lost a lot of money..I don’t want to do that again…and then “are you prepared to lose it again? No, I don’t want that to happen..so I need to make a change)


Brett? presuppositions... cpa and financial planner qs

presuppositions …forces the prospect to discover on their own the concept… (people don’t want to be told)… ex: when CPA showed how much tax you’d pay when take money out of qualified plan….how did you feel about that? he never showed me … ok, so would that be important for you to know?… (presupposes something happened that you know likely didn’t actually happen) hhuh…would that be important for you to know? so when your financial planner showed you a strategy to protect your money to protect you in a market crash...why didn’t you get on board with that? what, he didn’t tell me… So when your financial planner showed you a strategy to protect your money so you’d never lose it in a market crash, but during the good years you could potential get upwards This works really to drive a wedge between them and their advisors…or the incumbent…destroy the credibility


Ground rules

set ground rules… 1: how long gonna take… 2: what you’re gonna do… 3: what to expect.. 4: and if you’re interested, then we’ll keep talking



Premises… 1: never again lose retirement money to crashes 2: stop taxes from eating up your retirement 3: create retirement income you won’t outlive



He never showed me that. Well what do you mean..why wouldn’t he do that? I mean, isn’t he your financial adviser?... isn’t it his job to bring you these kind of strategies? ask questions they don’t know answers to and tell them things they don’t know… instead of them being the big dog…and with the power… when they say “I don’t know” …they tune in better.. are you familiar with section 7702 of the tax code? any idea of what the highest tax bracket has been in the history of our country? 94%


Ryan Coplon Radio Interview Jan 18

Can you give me the 5 Min Story of Ryan Coplon? Ryan...”and bring an element of innovation to it..:. Depending on which side of the table you sit on when it comes to health care...either beneficial or detrimental to the business ...more & ...more seeking transparency as to why... these costs really are rising ...and there’re certain organizations ...challenging people to think about things differently... .. biggest gravitational shift is ..from the Way people generally think of insurance (depending on how the math works out) to more of a self-insured kind of model...helping to bring back down into the same stratosphere cost and value to the people that they’re providing these plans and services to.. and that’s the basis for which...we founded Echelon..our advisory and consulting ...be better stewards of the (retirement years)...the health care system ...provided an economic benefit... to the folk providing the plans And to them specifically Interviewer: That seems to be a logical way to handle a situation in which you can’t control the price on the Service side of the equation but you can absolutely help on the client side... Health wallet...dashboard of relevant info and digital health services all combined...telemedicine leverage (tax benefits) convenience and also save money Essentially what it does is act as a mechanism...where people’s can shop (EIUL...that brings a unique Suite of Benefits together because of 1: congress...2: what only insurance co’s can do, ...overlay overlays...) using recently adjusted/adjudicated claims information Ok...that sounds like...an incredibly simple ..smart approach How did you do? Ryan ..chicken and egg process in the sense that we’ve kinda ...we kinda draw this analogy pretty regularly and it kind of makes us laugh...we kinda of just take Health Care for what it is...We are becoming a society that is so in tune with finding good deals..People will run down to a department store and Look at para jeans and try em on and Touch-em feel em .. look at the price tag..then go man..I can go down the street and get those for $.70 on the dollar. I might as will do that. But then Will go wherever they tell us, to get orthoscopic knee Surgery without doing any due diligence on the front end. And it seems to be inherently the most important thing Considering it’s your health and the ticket associated sometimes... it’s just the thing that people generally only are not wired to do... As the cost trajectory goes into the Stratosphere, every buddy is starting to go what’s the real problem here? And a lot of it is consumer behaviorand The other part of it really is the capitalistic nature of The healthcare system. We have a really interesting relationship with a good friend of ours who actually sits And operates a business in Houston that is third-party outsourced practice management and billing optimization and so.. we use him as a subject matter expert quite often, when we are talking to large payers about about his job and the reason his businesses so successful..Because he helps doctors offices to maximize their revenue From every belly button that walks through the door through to coding it correctly... knowing that that is out there basically created environment that. .. it’s potentially very lucrative to be a doctor.. which it should be, but those are two forces that are seriously working against each other. And we found it very interesting that we can just put the power back into the pocket of The people then they will change their behavior and Interviewer... as you move forward as Basically a pioneer in the space Which also indicates that you are I thought leader because You go in a direction and approach these problems from a ..The most organic and Most Efficient Way..To come up with a solution. When you lead the pack You get to see stuff before everybody else does ...As a thought leader, without giving away anything that would get either one of us into trouble... is there a horizon that has caught your attention? That you think, all OK this is a good direction to move in? Absolutely. We started in the business On behalf of organizations and businesses that are ..looking to finance their risk, which also includes healthcare liability... in a manner that changes the financial trajectory... so for us, it’s clear and evident that.. The unknowns associated with the regulatory Environment around employee benefits...All of the things that ultimately... The environment that we are in create a.. clear opportunity for pioneers... Who may take the arrows of course... to just challenge the way that Organizations and subsequently all The employees in the families to which they provide these benefits...challenging them to think differently...our “That we use even our sales presentation...Is that good Companies find client and Prospect needs and meet them And even exceed in meeting them, and great Companies change The way they think completely. And I think that we are so stuck in the way that we think About what healthcare is... That there’s so much opportunity to be an entrepreneur in the healthcare space. To change that and provide impact and BALANCE for people that is not just monetary... Literally creating an environment to where the access To healthcare is is easier and more affordable. The trajectory we are currently on is making it increasingly more relevant. Interviewer: Interviewed a guy the other day that says there is an inherent difference between worth and value..That are two different concepts that are not even two sides of the same coin and That you have found a way to approach The use of value..And that is a much more intelligently intelligent way to approach This particular problem. Interviewer....there must’ve been more to it...some underlying


From Plum Annuity mailer

What percentage of your income are you contributing to your plan?    

At what age do you expect to retire?    

Are you confident your retirement plan is realistic to meet this age?    YesNo

Current Age    

Years of Service    

What percentage of your income are you contributing to your plan?    


At what age do you expect to retire?


Are you confident your retirement plan is realistic to meet this age?    YesNo


Current Age    

Years of Service