who was dissatisfied with Socrates's arguments?
Socrates's three classes of things that are good:
the intrinsically good, the intrinsically and consequentially good, and what is wearisome but consequently good
what belongs to the second, the best of "fairest" class of goods?
the view most people have is that if any just man were put in the posistion of Gyges (whose ring made him invisible) and could act unjustly without being detected, he would do so for his own benefit
the city arises because indiviuals are not self-sufficient
when is the city-state best organized?
under the principle of the natural division of labor, with each person performing a single task for which he is naturally suited
what requires a larger sized city-state than was initially evident.
natural division of labor
the luxurious polis
the feverish city
having gone beyond what is necessary the city will be subject to two further needs:
for physicians to relieve suffering from gluttony and for more territory to satisfy greater wants
new class of warriors
what requires warfare to gain and protect this additional territory as well as the guardians?
the need to relieve suffering from gluttony and for more territory to satisfy greater wants
What must have guardians have for their task?
natural aptitude, they must be high-spirited yet gentle to those they are guarding. they must have the "philosophical" temper of a good guard-dog
education for the purified polis
two kinds of training are appropriate: gymnastics (physical training) for the body and music (the arts) for the osul
education of the guardians:
only poetry and music that promote good character is permissible in the education of the guardians
what is the task of physicians and jurists?
to maintain health and justice, not to restore or produce them where they are absent
what case is held as a bad model: every man has his own prescribed task to fulfill and should not shirk his duties by spending his time being cured or reformed?
what does the trianing of guardian require?
instilling a combination of harshness and gentleness that requires harmonizing the spirited and wisdom-loving elements of their nature
what passage presents blood tie to one's native country and the hierarchy of talents?
Phoenician tale: the Noble Lie: Myth of the Metals
what is the key?
education. if it is not well-maintained, laws are powerless to improve a city.
a city here established is completely good and must therefore be wise, brave, and moderate; justice is what remains when the other three parts are identified
wisdom of the city-state
it is wise by virtue of its sound judgment, which is through the knowledge of its guardians. so it is wise by virtue of a very small part of itself: that is, the rulers, who have this knowledge
bravery of the city-state
lies in its soldier (auxilary) class. it is the ability to preserve correct belief about what is to be feared
moderation in the city-state
lies int he state as a whole, consisting in a natural harmony about who should rule (the better should govern the worse)
justice in the city-state
consists in each part of the city- each class- performing its own task. injustice is meddling by these groups in each other's tasks
three parts of the soul
discussion of reason (nous), will =(thumos the spirited part), and appetite (epithumia) in the individual
a presupposition (unquestioned assumption or hypothesis: hypothemenol)
kallipolis: beautiful city
first wave of criticism
wives must also strip and share in the toils of war and defense of the country
second wave of criticism
consists of objections against the idea that wives and children should b held in common and that children and parents should not know each other
third wave of criticism
discussion of whether it is possible for such a city-state to exist
parable of the ship of state
the philosopher is compared with a man who knows that one must look at the stars to navigate well. he is useless only because others do not make use of him. he is not one to beg others to allow themselves to be ruled by them
Rosenzweig on faith
“Faith cannot be proven or defended, but only lived, Rosenzweig taught. It is not a system of beliefs but an existential choice, not a proof but an affirmation.” – Spengler column http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/GK22Aa01.html
Why, according to Bloom must philosopher pay attention to politics?
The stark recognition that he depended on the city, that as he looked up to the heavens he lost his footing on the ground, compelled the philosopher to pay attention to politics, to develop a philosophic politics, a party, as it were, to go along with the other parties, democratic, oligarchic, aristocratic and monarchic, that are always present. He founded the truth party. . . . The problem for the philosophers is primarily religion.
What is philosophers' truth?
The philosopher, to the extent that he really only enjoys thinking and loves the truth, cannot be disabused.
Why, according to Bloom, does the philosopher not lobe to tell the truth, what makes him willing to lie?
The philosopher wants to know things as they are. He loves the truth. That is an intellectual virtue. He does not love to tell the truth. That is a moral virtue. Presumably he would prefer not to practice deception; but if it is a condition of his survival, he has no objection to it.
What does Spengler mean to say that Europe's determination to destroy its Jews was an act of suicide
averred Rosenzweig, to which one might add that Eu-rope's determination to destroy its Jews was not just an act of genocide, but of suicide. European Christianity did not survive the regression back to the blood-line of the nations during the middle of the past century. Only in a new nation [America] conceived in the spirit, that is, in ideas, and free of the taint of pagan birth, could Christianity truly flourish.”
community of blood
Christians are torn between belief in Kingdom of Heaven and their belief in their own blood. It is the Jew, he argued, who converts the inner pagan inside the Christian. Only a "community of blood" provides man with the assurance of immortality, Rosenzweig argued. God's covenant with the physical descendants of Abraham provides such surety to the Jews, and precisely for this reason the Jews provide Christians with proof of God’s promise of a New Covenant.
where is Christianity able to flourish?
Only in a new nation [America] conceived in the spirit, that is, in ideas, and free of the taint of pagan birth, could Christianity truly flourish.”
Why does Adeimantus object to the Guardians?
Socrates has given the guardians no incentives, saying they will be no better off than mercenaries.
What are the two great corrupters?
wealth and poverty
How will the frugal state defend itself?
1) it will have trained warriors against an army of rich men, 2) it will never lack allies whom it offer any spoils they may claim, and 3) it need not fear any state or combination of states be-cause it is a true (united) state and they are divided into rich and poor classes and divided from each other.
what is justice in the state?
“is the equity or fairness that grants each social group its due and ensures that ‘each does one’s own work.’”
Who are Alkinoos and Arete?
Phaeacian rulers Alkinoos and Arete—King ‘Mighty-Mind’ and Queen ‘Virtue’
general knowledge or opinion
knowledge needed for making sound judgement
what is wrong with students of dialectic?
filled full with lawlessness
to model one’s desires and dispositions after the widely shared practices of one’s community.
is the privation of both sōphrosunē [self-control, moderation] and phronēsis [intelligent judgment]. or folly
What is Plato’s Analogy (Simile) of the Sun? How do Socrates’s Divided Line and Allegory of the Cave distinguish between opinion and knowledge?