Respiratory Flashcards

(153 cards)

1
Q

Advantage of BAL over tracheal wash

A

More sensitive

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2
Q

Difference between endotracheal wash and transtracheal wash

A

Transtracheal wash - through trachea done conscious
Endotracheal wash - under GA down ET tube

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3
Q

indications for bronchoscopy

A

Need samples
Airway assessment/treatment
Unexplained clinical signs

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4
Q

BAL types

A

Bronchoscopic - pre-oxygenate, sterile saline via catheter
Non-bronchoscopic - urinary catheter down ET tube, lung of interest positioned downwards

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5
Q

What is BAL useful for

A

Bronchopneumonia
Eosinophilic bronchopneumonia
Parasites
Chronic bronchitis

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6
Q

What is transtracheal wash useful for

A

Bronchopneumonia
Chronic bronchitis
Parasites

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7
Q

What occurs with chronic airway disease

A

Thickening of airways
Distortion
Mucous
Thinning of walls

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8
Q

What does oslerus osleri causr

A

Nodules in the trachea

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9
Q

Areas to look at for sneezing and nasal discharge

A

Facial symmetry
Eyes
Air flow
Lymph nodes
Nasal planum pigmentation
Teeth
Pain

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10
Q

Diagnostics for sneezing/nasal discharge

A

History
CS
Imaging
Rhinoscopy
Cytology
Serology
Nasal flush

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11
Q

How does aspergillosis present in dogs

A

Medium/long nosed breeds
Marked destruction of turbinates
Mucopurulent discharge with intermittent epistaxis
Pain on palpation
Sneezing
Deformity

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12
Q

How does nasal planum neoplasia present

A

Carcinoma - squamous cell, mets rare
White cats
Photodynamic therapy/planectomy to treat

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13
Q

Nasal cavity neoplasia

A

Normally malignant
Carcinomas in dogs

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14
Q

What is a cough

A

Reflex due to airway irritation, glottis closes, intrathoracic pressure increases, glottis opens to expel air quickly

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15
Q

Aetiology canine chronic bronchitis

A

Tracheal collapse
Chronic barking
FB
Previous infection/inhaled toxins
Environmental

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16
Q

Differentials for acute cough

A

Tracheobronchitis
Irritation
Fb
Pulmonary haemorrhage
Acute pneumonia
Acute oedema
Airway trauma

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17
Q

Differentials for chronic cough

A

Chronic bronchitis
Oslerus/aelurostrongylus
Tracheal collapse
Fb
Bronchopneumonia
Pulmonary neoplasia
Extra-luminal mass
Eosinophilic disease

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18
Q

Infectious tracheobronchitis causes

A

Canine parainfluenza
Canine adenovirus
Bordetella bronchiseptica

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19
Q

Anti-tussives

A

Don’t use unless absolutely necessary as normally protective
Butorphanol/codeine

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20
Q

Canine chronic bronchitis

A

Neutrophilic/eosinophilic infiltration of mucosa
Thickening of smooth muscle, fibrosis/scarring of lamina propria
Oxidative injury and inflammatory cells damage
Loss of ciliated epithelium

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21
Q

Signalment for canine chronic bronchitis

A

Small/toy breeds more common
Worse with excitement
Harsh cough
Externally well but often obese

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22
Q

What does bronchi-ectatic mean

A

Dilated airways
Shows as bronchial donuts

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23
Q

What do BAL results for canine chronic bronchitis typically show

A

Increased mucous
Non-regenerative neutrophils, eosinophils, macrophages
Cushman’s spiral - airway mucus casts

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24
Q

Management of chronic bronchitis

A

Weight control
Harness walks
Avoid irritants or smoking
Avoid dry environments
Oral/inhaled Glucocorticoids
Bronchodilators
Courage
Antimicrobials with need

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25
Treatments for lower airway disease
Inhaled medications - corticosteroids, bronchodilators, nebulizers delivered by mask, spacing device, metered dose inhaler Expensive, time consuming, owner compliance, patient compliance
26
What is salbutamol
Beta 2 agonists Fast onset, lasts 3 hours Cleared renally 10-20% reaches lower airways SE - tachycardia, arrhythmias, tremors
27
Inhaled Corticosteroids
Fluticasone propionate Slowly absorbed from lungs but dwells Rapid liver metabolism Long half life Bronchodilatory and anti-inflammatories
28
Benefits of bronchodilators
Reduction in lower airway spasm Decreases tendency for airway collapse improves muco-ciliary clearance Inhibits mast cell degranulation
29
Oral therapy for bronchitis
Anti-inflammatories Bronchodilators Antibiotics, anthelmintics Mucolytics
30
Feline bronchial disease
Feline asthma Type 1 hypersensitivity Suspected breed disposition eg Siamese Smoke/feathers/inhaled dust Can lead to chronic bronchitis
31
Common pathogens causing bacterial bronchopneumonia
E.coli Klebsiella Pasteurella Staphs Streps Mycoplasma Bronchiseptica
32
Is primary bacterial bronchopneumonia common
No it's rare, look for the underlying cause
33
What does S.equi zooepidemicus cause in dogs
Fatal haemorrhagic pneumonia Highly contagious, sudden onset CS - pyrexia, dyspnoea, haemorrhagic nasal discharge, haemoptysis
34
Predisposing factors to bronchopneumonia
Debilitation Prolonged recumbency Immunosuppression Immunodeficiency Defective respiratory defenses Damaged epithelium Aspiration Airway obstruction Systemic sepsis Bronchiectasis
35
Diagnosis of bacterial bronchopneumonia
CBC, biochemistry, UA, faecal Thoracic radiography- early disease can show interstitial pattern only Airway sampling - culture and cytology on fluid
36
Treatment of bacterial bronchopneumonia
Antibiotics Supplemental humidified oxygen IVFT Anti inflammatories Bronchodilators Mucolytics Physiotherapy Nebulization Surgery
37
What is the first thing you should do with respiratory noise
Localise it
38
What should you approach in the consult
Critical assessment of patient - emergency? Condition Breathing - rate, pattern, regularity, depth, effort MM colour - pale, cyanotic, normal Behaviours worrying the owner
39
Which breathing phase is longer
Inspiratory
40
What is orthopnoea
Dyspnoea in any position other than standing/erect sitting
41
What is trepopnoea
Dyspnoea only on one lateral - unilateral lung/pleural disease
42
What are the two types of alveolar cell
Type 1 - very thin squamous cell lining 95% alveolar surface Type 2 - cuboidal cell secreting surfactant
43
What are the 4 areas that cause breathing difficulty
URT - inspiratory difficulty, noise, normally surgical, emergency tracheostomy Pleural space - muffled heart/lung sounds, thoracic ultrasound, remove fluid Lung itself - stuff in alveoli of interstitium Non-crs - metabolic/physiologic, rapid shallow breathing, severe difficulty
44
Clinical signs of cat flu
Wheezing Coughing Nasal discharge Spotty tongue Ocular discharge/discolouration
45
What is special about FHV-1 (herpes)
Sheds intermittently and without disease for life but exacerbated by stress
46
What type of virus is calicivirus
RNA related to norovirus
47
Key points about calicivirus
Shed by >80% cats in multi cat Spontaneous outbreaks of severe disease Tongue ulcers Floppy kittens with synovitis
48
How do you treat Chlamydia feliz
Doxycycline 10mg/kg daily for 4 weeks Presents with swollen conjunctiva
49
Difficulties of chronic rhinitis in cays
Have snuffles so don't re-home well Antibiotics can have to be prolonged Long time decongestants Specific antivirals
50
What is FCGS
Feline chronic gingivitis stomatitis Associated with FCV Full mouth extraction Antibacterials
51
Diagnosing feline respiratory tract disease
Only when management will change Oral/ocular swabs Viral transport medium PCR
52
Treatment for feline respiratory disease
Supportive care - nutritional, fluids, anti-inflammatories, nebulizers, eye drops, Specific - antivirals
53
Prevention/control of feline respiratory disease
Hygiene, ventilation Disinfection Low stress Vaccination
54
What is CIRD
Canine infectious respiratory disease
55
Clinical signs of kennel cough
Hacking cough Submandibular lymphadenopathy Ocular/nasal discharge Lethargy Pyrexia
56
What is canine adenovirus-2
Non enveloped DNA Closely related to CAV-1 Vaccine based on CAV-2 for core
57
What is canine parainfluenza virus
Enveloped RNA virus Upper URT only Subcutaneous and intranasal vaccines
58
Pathogenesis of CIRD
Disrupts muco-ciliary escalator allowing bacterial invasion
59
What is canine coronavirus
Enveloped RNA Not the same as enteric coronavirus
60
What is bordetella bronchiseptica
Primary/secondary disease Mild - severe Shedding 12 weeks post infection
61
What is canine distemper virus
Enveloped RNA, she'd in all body fluids CS - bronchopneumonia, purulent ocular and nasal discharge, haemorrhagic vomiting and diarrhoea, neurological signs
62
Can strep equi effect dogs
Yes Causes pyrexia, bloody nasal discharge and haematemesis
63
Prevention of canine respiratory disease
Hygiene limit dog to dog contact Ventilation Vaccination
64
Clinical signs of infectious respiratory disease
Nasal dist Ocular swelling/discharge Coughing Dyspnoea/tachypnoea Stertor/stridor Pyrexia Depression Lethargy Inappetence
65
Treatment for canine respiratory disease
Symptomatic - avoid choke chains - clean eyes/nose -nsaids - anti-tussives (butorphanol/codeine/ Antibiotics - rarely necessary as viral - if used for secondary pathogens - tetracyclines, potentiated sulphonamides
66
Canine influenza
Cough/ purulent discharge 10-30 day duration 20% very unwell with pyrexia/pneumonia ~8% die Vaccines in US Serological evidence in foxhounds
67
How do bronchial foreign bodies present
Sudden onset coughing/gagging
68
Diagnostics for bronchial foreign bodies
Thoracic radiographs -can see pleural involvement but often difficult Bronchoscopy - visualisation and retrieval look in all lobes
69
Primary pulmonary tumours
>50% are solitary and often caudal right love - lobectomy Present with non productive cough and exercise intolerance
70
What family are most lungworms from
Metastrongyloides (Inc. oslerus osleri, filaroides, crenosoma vulpis, aelurostrongylus abstrusus, angiostongylus vasorum)
71
Oslerus osleri
10-18week PPP Immune response to adult in trachea and bronchus Dry rasping cough, exercise associated 6-12 month dogs most common Bronchoscopy best diagnosis, L1 in faeces possible but variable Fenbendazole treatment
72
Filaroides hirthi
Treat as oslerus osleri Diffuse broncho-interstitial pattern
73
Crenosoma vulpis
Fox lung parasite can affect dogs PPP 3 days Indirect life cycles with slugs/snails Adults in bronchi/bronchioles Investigate and treat as oslerus osleri
74
Thoracic FNA
Ultrasound guidance Lesions >1cm Contraindicated by coagulopathy, pneumothorax, infectious process, pulmonary hypertension Complications - pneumothorax, empyema, bleeding, implantation, seeding neoplasia
75
What causes stertor
Reverberation of the nasopharynx
76
Stages of laryngeal collapse
Stage 1 - laryngeal saccule eversion Stage 2 - medial deviation of the cuneiform cartilage and aryepiglottic fold/aryepiglottic collapse Stage 3 - medial deviation of corniculate process of arytenoid cartilage/corniculate collapse
77
aetiology of laryngeal collapse
neurogenic atrophy of laryngeal muscles dysfunction of recurrent laryngeal nerves generalised neuropathy CNS origin hypothyroidism
78
clinical signs of laryngeal dysfunction
stridor cough dyspnoea change in phonation exercise intolerance collapse signs related to severity of disease CS worse when hot or exercised
79
diagnosis of laryngeal collapse
characteristic signs - auscultation of larynx/thorax laryngoscopy - swallowing level laryngoscope inflated radiographs haematology/biochemistry
80
emergency management for laryngeal collapse
rest supplemental oxygen sedation iv access corticosteroid anaesthesia
81
tracheal collapse signs
goose honk cough pulling on collar/lead exercise things that make the dog cough latero-lateral flattened trachea
82
medical management of tracheal collapse
antitussives bronchodilators antibiotics nsaids inhaled corticosteroids/bronchodilaters
83
surgery for tracheal collapse
open ring procedure stenting (must contact whole tracheal wall)
84
fungal rhinitis cause
Aspergillus fumigatus
85
CS of aspergillus
mucopurulent nasal discharge progressing to bilateral intermitted epistaxis ulceration/depigmentation of nasal planum pain on palpation sneezing
86
diagnosis of aspergillosis
history clinical signs blood tests - coagulopathy diagnostic imaging - radiography of nose/sinuses, CT/MRI rhinoscopy cytology serology
87
treatment for aspergillosis
challenging prolonged oral anti-fungal 'azoles' topical therapy - enilconazole, clotrimazole best delivery by catheter into frontal sinuses
88
feline chronic rhinitis
common cause of nasal discharge inflammation of the chonchae increased mucous production can be mild or severe endoscopically similar to dogs
89
surgery for stenotic nares
wedge resection alar fold resection
90
surgeries of the soft palate
partial staphylectomy folded flap palatoplasty - thins and pulls forward to shorten palate tonsilectomy - often included in soft palate surgery
91
arytenoid lateralisation surgery
tie back prevent dynamic collapse of arytenoid cartilages - normally unilateral
92
post op care for laryngeal tie back
observe feeding/drinking rest 2-3 weeks antibiotics analgesia harness not collar
93
complications of laryngeal tie back
seroma formation aspiration pneumonia inadequate lateralisation failure change in bark
94
Signalment for lower airway disease in cats
Older - hyperthyroidism, neoplasia, cardiac disease Younger - infectious causes
95
History for lower airway disease in cats
Age at presentation Presentation - acute, episodic, chronic
96
Feline asthma
Reversible Inhaled allergen Airway hyper reactivity Bronchoconstriction Eosinophilic airway inflammation Signs - episodic respiratory distress, dyspnoea, coughing
97
Chronic bronchitis
Response to infection/inhaled irritants Airway damage Excess mucous Neutrophilic airway inflammation Coughing
98
Pathogenesis of lower airway disease in cats
Hyperreactivity of bronchial smooth muscle - type 1 hypersensitivity, autonomic imbalance, muco-ciliary imbalance Acute bronchoconstriction in response to triggers Inflammation of bronchial mucosal lining Can develop pneumothorax or spontaneous rib fracture if bad
99
Differentials for coughing
Upper respiratory tract disease Inflammatory lower airway disease Infectious - bacterial, viral and parasitic FB Neoplasia
100
Feline lungworm
Aelurostrongylus abstrusus Paratenic hosts required PPP 1-2 months Most cats are asymptomatic Presentation - young, mild coughing but can progress to dyspnoea.
101
Diagnosis and treatment of feline lungworm
Radiography similar to inflammatory disease Airway wash Consider faecal floatation Treatment - fenbendazole
102
Mycoplasma pneumonia
Mycoplasma felis Lower airway disease but may cause URT signs CS - fever, cough, tachypnoea, lethargy Treatment - doxycycline
103
Mycobacterial pneumonia
M.bovis/M.microti Pneumonia= late stage systemic infections Early cutaneous signs - bite from vole/rodent, non-healing sores/nodules Early GI signs - contaminated milk ingestion, vomiting, diarrhoea, weight loss, poor appetite Diagnosis - histopathology/PCR Treatment - 6months rifampicin, pradofloxacin, azithromycin
104
Diagnostic plan for feline lower airway disease
Haematology/biochemistry Diagnostic imaging Faecal analysis Bronchoscopy Endotracheal wash
105
Treatment in an airway crisis
Management inflammation - dexamethasone IV Manage bronchospasm - tetrabutaline - smooth muscle relaxant, bronchodilation - inhaled salbutamol Oxygenate
106
Thoracic radiographs for feline LRT
Can be normal Bronchial +/- interstitial pattern Hyperinflation Air trapping Collapse of right middle lung lobe Can have patchy alveolar pattern Can have aerophagia
107
Thoracic radiographs for feline LRT
Can be normal Bronchial +/- interstitial pattern Can look hyperinflated Air trapping Collapse of right middle lung lobe Can have patchy alveolar pattern Can have aerophagia
108
Bronchoscopy
See - hyperaemia, oedema, excess mucous, decreased airway diameter Complications - irritation, movement of mucous, bronchospasm
109
BAL cat
Cytology - eosinophilic inflammation suggests feline inflammatory disease, viral pneumonia, parasites hypereosinophilic syndrome Culture Mycoplasma PCR
110
Causes for breathing difficulties
Loss of thoracic capacity - pleural effusion, pneumothorax, neoplasia, ruptured diaphragm, abdominal abnormality, gross cardiomegaly
111
Clinical signs of pleural space disease
Restrictive breathing pattern - short shallow breaths Tachypnoea Open mouth breathing Dyspnoea Orthopnoea - elbow abduction, sternal recumbency Cyanosis
112
Clinical exam for pleural space disease
Observe respiratory pattern Percussion Palpate apex beat
113
Pleural effusion
Muffled heart/lung sounds ventral when standing Percussion - fluid line Different fluids can be present - transudate - modified transudate - exudates - non septic, septic, blood, chyle
114
Transudate pleural effusion
Pure transudate due to increased oncotic pressure due to hypoalbuminemia Commonly caused by increased hydrostatic pressure secondary to right sided heart failure. Can be diaphragmatic hernias, lung lobe torsion, neoplasia
115
Septic Exudative pleural effusion causes
Non septic - fip, neoplasia, chronic chylothorax, chronic lung lobe torsion, fungal infection
116
Non septic exudative pleural effusion
Septic - penetrating chest wound, FB, ruptured oesophagus, ruptured pulmonary abscess/tumour, haematogenous bacterial spread Can be hard to aspirate
117
Chylothorax causes
Disruption of thoracic duct Lymphangiectasia, cranial vena cava obstruction, neoplasia, heart disease, fungal infection, lung lobe torsion, diaphragmatic hernia
118
Hemothorax causes
Trauma Coagulopathy Neoplasia Lung lobe torsion
119
Diagnosis of pleural effusion
Clinical findings Diagnostic imaging - ultrasound easy, xray also shows Thoracocentesis - dorsal ribs space 7, asepsis, ultrasound for fluid pocket
120
Chest drain use
Animals that require multiple thoracocentesis over a short time period
121
Treatment for pneumothorax
Treat primary cause Heart failure Pericardial effusion - drainage Pyothorax - antibiotics, systemic/local, lavage, long course Chylothorax - diet/surgery
122
Pneumothorax
Rupture of major airway/lung parenchyma. Bullous, necrotizing or neoplastic lung disease Clinical findings - restrictive breathing - auscultation, dull sounds dorsally, increased ventrally - percussion - increased resonance
123
Diagnosis of pneumothorax
Physical exam Respiratory assessment Thoracic radiographs Blood gases Thoracic ultrasound
124
Pathophysiology of pneumothorax
Loss of negative pressure means lungs don't inflate as ribcage is raised Severity depends on degree of pneumothorax
125
Tension pneumothorax pathophysiology
Lesion in lung parenchyma acts as one way valve Pleural pressure rises causing lung compression Pressure can exceed venous pressure reducing venous return to heart Rapidly life threatening
126
Treatment of pneumothorax
Oxygen Drain but avoid over drainage Some will require chest drains and heimlich valve Can require surgery
127
What is spontaneous pneumothorax
Caused by ruptured pulmonary bulla or sub pleural bleb. Can occur with chronic asthma CS - dyspnoea, anorexia, vomiting Can require surgery Prognosis depends on cause
128
Mediastinal disease
Benign/malignant tumours, cystic lesions, enlarged lymph nodes/haematomas CT very useful, diagnosis challenging
129
Mediastinal lymphoma
Common in young cats CS - tachypnea, inspiratory hyperpnoea, full heart sounds, pleural effusion Treatment - chemo +/- radiotherapy
130
Thymoma
Rare - most common in older dogs From thymic epithelium Present with respiratory distress, cranial cabal syndrome, myasthenia gravis Diagnosis - thoracic radiographs, cytology Surgical resection best Poor prognosis is old
131
Thyroid tumours
Sink into the thorax Confirmation on scintigraphy Treat with radioactive iodine or surgery
132
Pleural tumours
Rare Causes large volume effusions and pain Multifocal small masses, hard to image Can do thoracoscopy histopathology best diagnosis Treatment via intra-cavitady carboplatin/cisplatin
133
Rib tumours
Osteosarcoma/chondrosarcoma Can be aggressive Treatment = rib resection
134
Differentials for alveolar disease
Aspiration pneumonia Pulmonary oedema Pulmonary haemorrhage Eosinophilic lung disease Pulmonary parasites Pulmonary neoplasia Interstitial disease
135
Clinical signs of pulmonary parenchymal disease
Increased inspiratory and expiratory effort Cough can be present Can see haemoptysis, collapse/syncope, cyanosis Lung crackles Change in bronchovesicular sounds
136
Aspiration pneumonia
Signs - cough, harsh/reduced lung sounds, tachypnea, pyrexia Radiographs for infiltrate - alveolar pattern with border obliteration and air bronchograms BAL to confirm Treat with supportive care, antibiotics, and underlying cause
137
Anti-biotics for alveolar disease
Select on C and S Lipophilic best to penetrate the blood bronchus barrier Bactericidal best May need combination and long treatment period Azithromycin has good distribution. Metronidazole accumulates well Tetracyclines reasonable concentration Penicillins variable
138
Mucolytic use in alveolar disease
Reduce mucous accumulation and helps with impaired muco-ciliary clearance Bisolvon licensed
139
Pulmonary oedema causes
Increased hydrostatic pressure Reduced oncotic pressure Increased vascular permeability Impaired lymphatic drainage Leads to fluid accumulation in the interstitium
140
Differentiation between cardiogenic and non cardiogenic pulmonary oedema
Cardiogenic - low protein due to increased hydrostatic pressure without increased vascular permeability Non-cardiogenic - lung damage leads to protein leaking through increased vascular permeability Cardiogenic much more common
141
Non cardiogenic - alveolar disease
Damaged epithelium Increased vascular permeability leads to higher protein fluid in alveoli. Removal requires active transport so if epithelium damaged it wont occur. More refractory than cardiogenic Causes - hypoalbuminemia causes pulmonary oedema - lymphatic drainage more likely to cause cylous effusion - pulmonary epithelial injury most common due to things like choking, drowning, electric shock, head trauma, smoke inhalation and sirs
142
Physical lung injury
Pulmonary contusion - ventilation perfusion mismatch, chest wall damage/pain Will have a lag phase before visible on radiographs Supportive care
143
Eosinophilic lung disease
More common in dogs, young adults. Can be acute or chronic Coughing and weightloss common Diffuse bronchial interstitial pattern (doughnut pattern) Circulating eosinophilia BAL to diagnose Oral Prednisolone for treatment
144
Angiostongylus vasorum
Nematode that lives in pulmonary arteries Indirect lifestyle through slugs/snails L1 penetrates capillaries into alveoli to be coughed up and swallowwd
145
Clinical signs of angiostongylus vasorum
Cardiorespiratory - chronic cough, dyspnoea, exercise intolerance, syncope, tachypnoea - relate to burden Coagulopathies - anaemia, subcutaneous haematoma, internal haemorrhage, prolonged bleeding. Causes clotting failure (always test is unexplained clotting issue) Neurological dysfunction - paresis, depression, seizures, spinal pain, behavioral changes, ataxia, vision loss
146
Diagnosis of angiostongylus vasorum
L1 in faeces - faecal floatation/smears L1 in BAL Radiography for alveolar infiltrates Cage side snap PCR on BAL/pharynx swabs
147
Management of angiostongylus vasorum
Licensed - - imidacloprid and moxidectin Or - milbemycin oxime and praziquantal Fenbendazole - effective but unlicensed
148
Treatment of angiostongylus vasorum
Supportive care in addition to anthelmintics Bronchodilators Corticosteroids Phosphodiesterase inhibitor Cage rest and oxygen therapy Prevention
149
Interstitial pulmonary fibrosis
Middle age/older dogs Chronic breathlessness, coughing, exercise intolerance, cyanosis, syncope, can faint Clinical exam - crackles in lungs field. Prolonged expiratory phase with expiratory effort
150
Diagnosis of interstitial pulmonary fibrosis
Clinical signs - pulmonary hypertension, interstitial/alveolar pattern, general cardiomegaly, abdo distension, hepatomegaly Thoracic radiographs CT Bronchoscopy Lung biopsy
151
Treatment of interstitial pulmonary fibrosis
Symptomatic treatment Inhaled therapy - bronchodilator, corticosteroids Oral therapy - bronchodilator and corticosteroids Viagra effective for pulmonary hypertension Normally live 1 year but up to 4
152
Interstitial pneumonias
Not common. Disease affects the interstitium Associated with herpes virus
153
Metastatic disease
Often incidental finding Most common = osteosarcoma, hemangiosarcoma, thyroid carcinoma, melanoma of mucocutaneous junction Find Mets Need CT to find how many/where. Care in seeding with thoracoscopy Local chemo - penetration issues